Hardest jazz standard tune to play? « The Kurt Rosenwinkel Forum

Im wondering which tunes people here have the hardest time playing, either the head, solo over the changes, or both. For me it would be easy to pick a Coltrane changes song since I my repertoire of tunes is very limited. I find it hard to play over kinda of everything, but if I shuold chose one that sounds like utter shit whatever I do with it must be "the Sorcerer" by Herbie Hancock.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KU0gHit98tc

I laugh so hard at myself when I try to play this tune that I have to dry my eyes after only a short moment. Anyone else have tunes that kick you´re ass instead of the opposite?

Best, Sandemose

Posted 2 years ago
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denjz
Member

That's a hard one indeed.

What really knocked me off recently was these two by David Sanchez:

http://www.davidsanchezmusic.com/charts/Cultural-Survival_Piano.pdf

http://www.davidsanchezmusic.com/charts/Ay-Bendito_Guitar.pdf

I mean...even the head,let alone the blowing sections.

Posted 2 years ago
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animitta
Member

I think this one it's a good example too : )

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pZ0cWYGR0jY

All the Best
Animitta

Posted 2 years ago
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Sandemose
Member

Hey, I was more thinking of standards that you might find in one the realbooks though. Those tunes still sounded bitchy to play, nevertheless.

Best, Sandemose

Posted 2 years ago
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Goncalo.Monteiro
Member

I really think the most difficult standards are that ones with very simple harmony and melody!!

Cheers and Namaste
Goncalo

Posted 2 years ago
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animitta
Member

I knew what you intended but i thought that was funny to send that link too. And BTW i am a great estimator of Adam Rogers too : )

In my opinion there is not exactly a "hard tune", just tune "not yet familiar with" : ).

Music it's not a competition where the bravest play the hardest tunes. Music it's spiritual enlightment. Every tune, hard or simple, it's unique and every tune must be treated with respect for the composer. Tring to play the best you can and transmitting what you are by your interpretation.

Hard or simple, good or bad are only concepts. Often, at least inside the musical path, what it's hard today will be simple tomorrow, if you practice. And sometime viceversa, if your attention for the details and the developing of you ears become huge : ). In this case also a "simple" tune as Blue Bossa can be a great way to explore the musical universe.

Anyway, to my ear, at my actual stage, many Monk's tunes are not yet familiar. But i like that, i just need sometime more to practice : )

All the Best
Animitta

Posted 2 years ago
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Goncalo.Monteiro
Member

you are totally rigth Animitta

Posted 2 years ago
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wommusic
Key Master

On that "note"- have anybody here noticed the iPhone app called iReal Book that Massimo Biolcati (the bassplayer with Lionel Loueke among others) has developed? Shows changes to real book standards, and lets you transpose them to different keys...instantly. I think it's simple yet brilliant....!

No melodies in there though because he can't publish other peoples songs without paying them for it, but the same law does not apply to changes as you can't copyright those.

More here: http://www.irealbook.net

Posted 2 years ago
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denjz
Member

Oh,I see...

Sorry for the post with "View from Moscow" chart then...I'll delete the link.

Posted 2 years ago
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Sandemose
Member

denjz: why? Wasent that on another thread?

animitta: I totally agree with you, about being familiar with the tunes is the main thing. And, not to forget, creating good/beautiful music. The qustion might be not so well formulated, I intended more to know what tunes people here struggle with, even if they´re familiar with it. I wasnt implying in any way that music is a competetion where the hardest tunes is a way to demonstrate your chops etc.

But, isnt 26-2 "harder" than Autumn Leaves? Someone who can play effortlesley over 26-2, head and blowing over the chords would possible get through Autumn Leaves? But not perhaps the opposite? I find "Inner Urge" really hard on the head, esp. in the end. Its drives me nuts :(

Best, Sandemose

Posted 2 years ago
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denjz
Member

wommusic says it's illegal to publish other people's music if it contains the melody.Sorry...

Posted 2 years ago
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Sandemose
Member

denjz: to bad :(

Posted 2 years ago
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jazznan
Member

You didn't publish it, you posted it for educational reasons

Posted 2 years ago
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wommusic
Key Master

Hey Denjz, a little sharing on this message board won't hurt anybody - the law is if somebody would seriously attempt to sell a product containing other peoples music without compensating them for it.

Posted 2 years ago
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denjz
Member

Thanks, Anders.Thought it was a hint addressing me.Would never cause any troubles as I'm a big fan of Kurt's music.

Posted 2 years ago
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wommusic
Key Master

Hey Denjz, No not at all - wasn't a hint at all, I was just saying that the reason why Massimo can't include the actual melody to the tunes in his iReal Book is because of that law. :-)

Posted 2 years ago
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Anonymous

hello everyone i finally signed up for this great forum, i've been reading ur posts and you've been giving me great ideas, for that thank you, to kurt: to me ur an inspiration and a living book, congratulations on your new album i bought it and its great, full of emotion... anyways, i would have to vote on Conception, to play the changes in this tune is one thing, to sound lyrical and musical is something completely different.....

Posted 2 years ago
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natjanoff
Member

I find 26-2 and ESP to be tunes I have to keep playing with some regularity. I could also see how Conception and The Sorcerer could be very tricky
as well. Countdown is also a bastard as well!

Posted 2 years ago
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denjz
Member

Yeah,all the tunes with Coltrane changes are tough.
Nobody mentioned Inner Urge yet?
I also find Stablemates to be a tricky one.

Posted 2 years ago
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Anonymous

I really think the most difficult standards are that ones with very simple harmony and melody!!

Cheers and Namaste
Goncalo

I agree, The way you look tonight is more "difficult", for me, than Gian Steps. There is a lot to learn from the masters about the art of turnarounds.
Best, Jacky

Posted 2 years ago
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Sandemose
Member

Yeah, "the simple" ones make me sound awful as well. Like "Impressions". I feel completly naked when I play it. No crazy changes so hide behind. What you show, is what you have :) *brr..*

Sandemose

Posted 2 years ago
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Joshtaitmusician
Member

Gester Lester By kurt rosenwinkel

Thats incredibly hard

Posted 2 years ago
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Sandemose
Member

Joshtaitmusician: yeah, you´re right about that one. Perhaps it will turn out to be a standard as well in the future? This gave me an idea of a new topic I guess.

"What Kurt tunes do you think will end up as future standards" ? (see new thread, to off topic for this thread)

Best, Sandemose

Posted 2 years ago
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Anonymous

I find it works two ways.

Tunes with very simple repetitive harmony like I VI II V and III VI II V with a bridge that is the same only a 3rd or 4th away. It's a long time on tunes that don't go anywhere harmonically to create something interesting for extended periods of time, especially as rhythmsectionalists to deal with Tenor players wanking away (lol) for hours trying to play something hip. We can't all be Joe Lovano (best Tenor player on standard material like this imo)

Then it's tunes like ESP. That tune is a true bitch to play something unique over. Dolphin Dance is really hard to play as well between the pedal points and the strange harmonic shifts. I agree also on those Benny Golson tunes like Along Came Betty or Stablemates, weird keys and feel changes.

Coltrane changes aren't really an issue, you just have to live with them for a while. That's what Trane did, and his solo was rather rudimentary compared to what you hear ppl play over those types of changes now. Obviously I'm not taking anything away from him, I love that solo LOL.

Posted 2 years ago
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Hardest jazz standard tune to play?

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